Rust and Tracks
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Rust and Tracks
This debate has been going on in Fine Scale Modeller for over a year now, and has become quite heated, "Do tracks rust"?
People have been coming at it from all directions, those with experience in armoured units deny that their tracks "rusted" and that the hardened steel they are manufactured from develops a "patina" but not rust.
To my mind "patina" is oxidation i.e. rust. Similar to bluing this then prevents further destruction of the underlying metal as it provides a layer that blocks oxygen contact.
Others site the brake discs on your car. A little bit of rain and the following morning they have orange spots of fresh rust.
From personal experience (military service and visitor to military museums) I have not seen bright orange or even reddish rust on tracked vehicles. They do however have a dark brown patina.
These are some pics I took today at a vehicle collection in Wanaka, NZ. They suggest my memory is crap
Centurion MkV (Aust.) has been static for about 18mths.
There is orange rust on the outer aspect, but on the running gear side only a patina and the area protected by constant contact with the rubber tyres on the road wheels. The "red" on the drive sprocket is primer.
This Valentine has been in this condition since the 1950's
Again, no bright orange rust.
A non-military subject,
again no "orange" rust on the tracks.
I am now totally confused
Any thoughts, guidance, experience??
People have been coming at it from all directions, those with experience in armoured units deny that their tracks "rusted" and that the hardened steel they are manufactured from develops a "patina" but not rust.
To my mind "patina" is oxidation i.e. rust. Similar to bluing this then prevents further destruction of the underlying metal as it provides a layer that blocks oxygen contact.
Others site the brake discs on your car. A little bit of rain and the following morning they have orange spots of fresh rust.
From personal experience (military service and visitor to military museums) I have not seen bright orange or even reddish rust on tracked vehicles. They do however have a dark brown patina.
These are some pics I took today at a vehicle collection in Wanaka, NZ. They suggest my memory is crap
Centurion MkV (Aust.) has been static for about 18mths.
There is orange rust on the outer aspect, but on the running gear side only a patina and the area protected by constant contact with the rubber tyres on the road wheels. The "red" on the drive sprocket is primer.
This Valentine has been in this condition since the 1950's
Again, no bright orange rust.
A non-military subject,
again no "orange" rust on the tracks.
I am now totally confused
Any thoughts, guidance, experience??
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Re: Rust and Tracks
Hi Adam
great subject and a never ending discussion which will always have a photo to disprove any sweeping theory of "They will/ will not""!!!
Artistic license and 1:35 scale representation of "it looks like"
If the modeler is OK with it, that is all that matters at the end of the day.
The rivet counters seem to be critiques, not builders and painters, take it with a pinch of salt and ENJOY the hobby
I hope to, once again in 2017.
Nice one
Steve H
great subject and a never ending discussion which will always have a photo to disprove any sweeping theory of "They will/ will not""!!!
Artistic license and 1:35 scale representation of "it looks like"
If the modeler is OK with it, that is all that matters at the end of the day.
The rivet counters seem to be critiques, not builders and painters, take it with a pinch of salt and ENJOY the hobby
I hope to, once again in 2017.
Nice one
Steve H
""I need to be creative, to feel ALIVE!""
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Re: Rust and Tracks
Cheers Steve,
The wee tractor left out to rust has my interest now, looking for a similar one to build alongside the group build project!
Adam
The wee tractor left out to rust has my interest now, looking for a similar one to build alongside the group build project!
Adam
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Re: Rust and Tracks
Interesting topic and great photos, thanks Adam!
I guess we can all agree that 2mm sheet steel will rust different than a block of cast iron. And then there are other aspects, like the highly special alloys often used for tracks.
Here's a nice example of rusty cast steel. That thing has been sitting in the salty air of the French channel coast for over 200 years:
Philipp
I guess we can all agree that 2mm sheet steel will rust different than a block of cast iron. And then there are other aspects, like the highly special alloys often used for tracks.
Here's a nice example of rusty cast steel. That thing has been sitting in the salty air of the French channel coast for over 200 years:
Philipp
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Re: Rust and Tracks
The Centurion and Valentine were great examples of decay. I took a bunch of pics for reference as I'm still working on the perfect "rust" effect!
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Re: Rust and Tracks
Rust...............Rust.......did someone mention rust? More pics of the tractor would be nice too.
As far as the discussion goes, I have no set idea either way on what tracks should or shouldn't look like. To me the overall "look" of the subject is what counts and if rusty tracks are part of that then so be it.
I do note that the Pigments and Washes specifically for tracks from AMMO and AK are both Dark Brownish shades which tends to support your memory Adam.
I'm off to the bench.
Cheers,
Vincent
As far as the discussion goes, I have no set idea either way on what tracks should or shouldn't look like. To me the overall "look" of the subject is what counts and if rusty tracks are part of that then so be it.
I do note that the Pigments and Washes specifically for tracks from AMMO and AK are both Dark Brownish shades which tends to support your memory Adam.
I'm off to the bench.
Cheers,
Vincent
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Re: Rust and Tracks
I'm back in Wanaka with the family tomorrow and will swing past the vehicle collection on the way in to town and get a few more pics of the tractor. I think its a civilian D7 and a couple of model companies have kits out. The reviews of them suggest they are all a bit fiddly but we shall see!
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Re: Rust and Tracks
More pics of the wee D7 as requested
Plenty of "rust" and "decay" reference there
Plenty of "rust" and "decay" reference there
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Re: Rust and Tracks
Thanks Adam, those tractor pics are awesome. I can definately make use of those. Thanks again.
Cheers,
Vincent
Cheers,
Vincent
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